juschuman
Pasadena, CA
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OK, so after a few trips with the TC and planning for a 2 week trip around the southwest with the horses, I am finally getting around to figuring out the dreaded "weight" issue.
I've been reading threads (TC university, etc) but am now more confused.
Here is my truck:
And my tires are Yokohama Geolander A/T LT285/75R16 load range "D" rated at 3305 lbs.
Recently we weighed the TC fully loaded, but without the additional weight of our horse trailer, which has a tongue weight of about 550lbs.
It came out to: 11480 Gross, 6900 on the rear and 4580 on the front.
Are we safe? Recommendations on tires/wheels etc?
Thanks for any help!
Jon
2004 F350 DRW Shortbox Crewcab - Stable Loads - 2000 Lance 820 - Torklift Superhitch w/Supertruss - Torklifts w/Fastguns - 1988 Circle J 2-Horse BP Straight Load
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silversand
Montreal
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Joined: 09/12/2004
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The 1st thing I notice, it that you down-graded your LR tire type from E (what you got from the factory) to LR D.
You are aware of this of course?
I think your Lance (820) is dry-weighted conservatively at about 2600 LBS + horse trailer you say is 500 LBS = 3100 LBS. Add cargo, roughly 600-LBS + horse, roughly an additional 300 LBS on the hitch, and you are at an astounding 4000 LBS (and we haven't added passenger weights yet!).
If I have this correct (can you verify?), I think that your rig, an F250 diesel, is astoundingly over-weight, and you are in (if my calculations are correct) imminent danger with those LR D tires, when all the above are loaded up. I think that your hauling safety margin is 0 (zero) and perhaps even in the negative.
IMO: you should consider 19.5 inch professional truck tires and rims asap, as a 1st step.
Cheers,
Silver-
* This post was
edited 08/05/08 03:22pm by silversand *
Silver
2004 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 6.0L Ext/LB Tow Package 4L80E Michelin AT2s| Outfitter Caribou
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Sportsman Matt
Blackstone, MA
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What does the truck list on the door for GAVW both front and rear? That's what will tell you how over or under you are.
Life is short, Play harder.
2002 GMC Sierra 1500 Regular Cab Long Bed 4.3L V6 Automatic 2WD
1989 Sunline C-750 Slide In Truck Camper
7'6" Floor, 11'6" OAL
Fishing and Hunting New England and eventually the world
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Raften
Northern Calfornia
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Joined: 01/27/2003
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No, I don't think you are safe. You have a single wheel rear axle with tires that are overloaded on the weight rating. On top of that you are carrying live animals that I assume are dear to you, at least get some E rated tires and drive very carefully and at a speed that will let you stay in control in an emergency.
On a side note, trailer tires are always suspect, especially tires made by Carlisle, keep a close eye on them while traveling. I would suggest a Radio Shack IR therometer so you can walk around the truck and trailer at each stop and look for a tire or bearing that is getting hotter than the others.
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DWeikert
York, PA
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You say you have load range D tires, 3305 lb ea. Assuming the tires are the weak link on the rear axle, which they usually are, you're good for 6610 lbs on the rear axle. The scales say you're carrying 6900 lbs on the rear axle without the horse trailer. I say that's not good!
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Mooney
Santa Barbara, Ca
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Your GVWR is 8,800 and you have 11,480 in total weight. That's 2,680 or nearly 25% more weight then the truck is rated to handle.
Heck with the tires, your axles aren't even rated to handle that weight.
I would say you're just a little (ok maybe a ton) over weight. In my opinion it would be hard to use modifications to make a truck safe that is this grossly overweight.
'08 Ford F550, Lariat, Link Air Suspension, Roll-A-Long Conversion, Twin Turbo 6.4, TorkLifts, SuperHitch, "Monster Duty Truckasaurus"
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fuelhauler
Southern Oregon
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I agree with Mooney that you are grossly overweight. You need to step up to a dually. By the time you add the horse trailer with horses your brakeing power is another concern. A one ton truck should have bigger brakes than that 3/4 ton.Upgrading to some 19.5 tires may give you a better saftey margin on tires, but your still overloading that rear axle as well as your GVWR.
2005 Dodge q/c 4x4 dually six speed pac brake
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gtkato
Aurora, CO
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ditto...to all the comments!
The ONLY way to salvage your situation would be to add 19.5" wheels and 'H" rated tires. That still does NOT make your rig totally safe because of your axle ratings. Tires and Wheels are your weakest point, and you are only as safe as your weakest link!
FlyFishn
2005 Dodge HD CTD w/Vision 19.5" Wheels & Michelin XDE tires, Rancho 9000 XL, Hellwig, Timbren, Air Bags, Super Hitch
2008 Hallmark XS with Carbon Fiber roof, Tork Lifts w/Fastguns, Honda 2000 iU, Solar
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juschuman
Pasadena, CA
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Thanks for all your responses. That's what I've been dreading to hear.
What i'm wondering is, why would lance make a camper for a shortbed HD truck like ours that grossly overloads our truck which is, a pretty heavy duty truck?
Even without the trailer, we are grossly overweight(?) So isn't everyone that has this camper overweight?
If the rear GAWR is 6084 and the front is 5200, by my math that adds up to 11284 total(?) or does it not work that way. So we weighed in at 11480 which is only a few hundred pounds over our GVWR.
I know we need to upgrade the wheels/tires, but I can't see us upgrading to a dually. Then we run into the issue of having a shortbed camper on a longbed truck. Then we'll need a new camper. When does it end!!?
So some of you are saying that even with the 19.5" wheels and H rated tires we cannot safely do this with this truck? I'm kind of wondering, what the hell did they make this camper for?
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PJ Colahan
Antioch, CA
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First to clarify:
1. GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) is the maximum permissible weight of a fully loaded vehicle. The GVWR is equal to or greater than the sum of the unloaded vehicle weight (UVW) plus the cargo carrying capacity (CCC).
In this case your vehicles weight is 11,480 and the GVWR is 8,800 which indicates that overall your vehicle is 2,680 pounds over weight.
2. GAWR (Gross Axle Weight Rating) is the maximum permissible loaded weight a specific axle is designed to carry.
In this case your front axle weight is 4,580 and the GAWR is 5,200 so you are fine in the front. Unfortunately, this is usually the case and the balance can't be transferred to the rear.
On the rear the axle weight is 6,900 and the GAWR is 6,048, so here you are 852 pounds over weight.
What I read out of this is:
Front axles; your rating and actual are fine. This is a good thing as you use the front to control your vehicle.
Rear axles, your overweight here by 852 pounds. This doesn't seem like much but this is supported by what is called unsprung weight. Meaning the axle is below the springs and must take the brunt of the punishment without the absorbing factor of the springs. Here you are putting excessive strain on the axles, wheel rims and tires. Here you can increase the capacity of the wheels and tires but the balance of the system must put up with the additional load. This means that you could just go through operation with only added maintenance on the brakes, bearings, driveline, rear end, etc, or you could have a major failure.
The combined load that the vehicle is supporting is 2680 pounds over weight. This is the sprung weight. It is supported by the springs and truck frame. You can compensate to some degree for this by using heavier springs and/or air bags to help. The frame will still be overloaded and subject to the additional twisting and bending forces between the springs and the load.
I am not saying that people don't overload their vehicles and many go through life without any major problems. On the other hand, you are asking your vehicle to do a lot and depending on the condition of your truck, your maintenance practices, your driving habits, the types of roads you travel and the fact that you are adding to this a horse trailer, which will increase your rear axle load, brake load, strain on the drive train, you are really pushing your luck.
Even if you are able to be one of the lucky ones and you have no problems driving your truck, TC and horses/trailer normally, what if you have to put your vehicle into an emergency situation where you have to make extreme moves. This can increase the load on your system easily by a factor of five. If anything lets go during this situation your going to loose it and even the best driver probably couldn't control it.
I hope that this helps, I know that it is not what you want to hear but you should consider a larger vehicle, 1 ton or greater. Even with a 1 ton I would think you would be pushing the capacity.
Regards,
PJ
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