The Texan
Summer: A Cool Climate Winter: A Warm Climate
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Chris wrote:Until employers realize that the new workampers don't need the job and start treating them with the proper respect there will continue to be problems and disagreements between workampers and employers. You just can't treat most workampers like high school dropouts who are only worthy of minimum wage simply because they are willing to work for minimum wage. Most actually earn more than their employers. The best reply yet, as it hits the nail square on the head. The DW and I will gladly clean bathrooms, as long as you don't lie to us or change the work expectations after we arrive.
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mpj
Mid-Missouri
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Quote:Chris wrote:
Until employers realize that the new workampers don't need the job and start treating them with the proper respect there will continue to be problems and disagreements between workampers and employers. You just can't treat most workampers like high school dropouts who are only worthy of minimum wage simply because they are willing to work for minimum wage. Most actually earn more than their employers.
As this topic's author, I want to thank everyone for their comments. In addition, I would like to reply to the above comment:
PLEASE don't lump all the employers into one category, just as we employers do not lump all the workampers into one category. There are many good ones and bad ones and everyone needs to do their homework to be sure they do not get a bad one - workamper or employer. My philosophy: "one rotten apple does NOT spoil the whole bunch".
MANY of the NEW workampers do NEED the job because they are not all retired. Some are families; some are young single; most are the retired, who may or may not have retired early. The original premise of Workamping was to give the retired something to do while they traveled around this great, big country of ours. As I stated before, the face of Workamping is changing and this is no longer true. We have received applications from people who think it is a great lifestyle (and for some it is) but they are young, not retired and need the 40 hours a week each + $$ to pay their bills. There are positions out there which offer what they want, they just need to do their homework and keep looking.
Many employers, like ourselves, do not treat workampers like high school drop outs. We rely on their experience in their former jobs to help us make things better for our customers. Many have better ideas, or a new approach, on doing something than we do. But then again, some do not. We look for those applicant who are genuinely interested in helping the employer (us), not those, who because of prior experience, think they know how to run our campground better than we do.
Minimum wage: some campgrounds do not pay anything and workampers gladly work for site only. And I am not just talking about the State/Federal parks. I am talking about private, family owned properties. Those of us with smaller campgrounds who do pay, can often only afford minimum wage (though what we pay is higher), if that, and often take from our own pocket the $$ to pay a workamper that week. We are, after all, a business. Most of our $$ go to the mortgage & insurance, the water/sewer bill, the electric, buildings and grounds maintenance (anything from cutting trees down to in ground repair work of the sewer, water, or electric). And lot of other things in between. Many workampers - even at minimum wage - have more $$ to put in their pocket than we as campground owners do.
To the Moderator: On that note, since there have been no additional suggestions for our workamper package, I think we should close this topic. Our ad for workers will appear shortly. To those of you who are interested: we hope youwill apply.
Good luck to all in your future workamper positions - and, as always, Thanks for listening!
mpj
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bigredoes
Wherever
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Joined: 05/06/2008
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Howdy
Ok, I am really not sure what end of the spectrum we land. We have NOT workkamped or volunteered anywhere as of yet, we have been exploring the possibility of doing just that. My/our 'problem' is that we do NOT want to work a fulltime job....we do NOT want to get paid for our work....we want to help out in a campground/park etc and only be compensated for our site.
Most of the ads we see from places that are looking for workkampers want significantly more hours worked than I am willing to work. Also I do not want to commit to working for 4-6 months at a time. So we have not even bothered to contact any of the jobs we see posted mostly because we feel we would be wasting the employers time with 'our requirements' - fair exchange of hours for their campsite and no additional hours with or without pay.
So I assume that our expectations are unrealistic to a prospective employer and that we will NEVER actually workkamp.
I would enjoy hearing from all - employer and employee - whether we are way out of line, or with any helpful suggestions.
Cheers,
Greg and Jean
“Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn’t do than by the ones you did."
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Riverchaser
Memphis, TN
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Joined: 03/19/2002
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We are planning on workcamping next year and bathrooms are fine with me. I had a small cleaning service for 25 years and think having my hands in toilets all of those years could be why I am so healthy. Built up my immunity and put bunches of calouses on my hands, proud of every one of them too.
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wepampercampers
Full-Timers Tillicum Beach, near Waldport Or.
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many state parks, out west anyway, use volunteers to maintain their parks....go to state parks web pages and they generally have a volunteer section....and all types of tasks too, corps of engineers use allot of volunteers also, the COE doen't use volunteers so much for hosting, but for projects/PR/assistance kinda things...........
wildlife refuges, fish and game, tons of opportunities...
http://www.volunteer.gov/Gov/index.cfm, is a good link to the federal stuff..........
then after you find something you like ask more questions here, usually someone on this forum has been there and can fill in your blanks.....
happy trails
Don
Jo 'n Don
www.PamperingCampers.com
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tjholyoke
Maine
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Joined: 08/23/2007
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We found short-term workamping this past summer. We are teachers and have summers off. We can help fill in for the busiest season for many campgrounds, and give ourselves an economical way to explore an area. The biggest issue we had was thinking we would work a maximum of 32 hours, and having another workamping couple leave just before we arrived. We ended up working 40+ hours each, often on opposite shifts. Didn't plan to spend so much time apart from one another. We didn't complain often, and worked to help management see where we could work at the same time more often. We were told we would have wireless Internet and cell service. Found out after we arrived that only Verizon cell service worked, and the wireless Internet was VERY sporadic. Tough to keep in touch with home. While we did have an overall good experience, we will be sure that we are clear in our arrangements and expectations up front. Anyone looking for part-time summer help? :-)
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The Texan
Summer: A Cool Climate Winter: A Warm Climate
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Joined: 01/16/2004
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Exactly what I was talking about, changing work expectations after arrival and telling half truths to get you there. This is much more common than some think and if campgrounds want to keep their good workers, they need to police their own ranks. Our experience this summer soured us on any commercial campground.
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rolnhome
Pacific Northwest Mexico
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Joined: 11/19/2007
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We only volunteer at State Parks. We found private parks put too many restrictions on workcampers, or at least our concept of workcamping. We started off thinking this would be a good way to help out, keep busy, travel, sightsee an area then move on. We also found that many/most positions were for 6 or more months. Also we found we would be working different hours that would keep us at the park 7 days a week (no time to explore the area) and the sites weren't always the best. Some wanted us to be independent contractors which ment we provide our own insurance should we be injured "on the job". Many people work as fulltime workcampers to support thier family so these positions would be good for them but, for us, using workcamping as a tool to travel and see the USA is to restrictive and pay/site/hours compensation was too complex and unflexiable. Volunteering in State Parks is a 30 day commitment (more if requested) and works best for us. We went with working State Parks and a campground membership which works great for us. I can understand why a private business would not want a work force turnover ever 30 days.
We're in Arizona
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WTTCS
freedom , U.S.A.
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Joined: 07/28/2003
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I know this question will get zapped, but.....
To the OP, why do you even bother to attempt to hire workampers? If you offer 30 hours per week at more than minimun wage, could you not hire a local person to do that job? What are the advantages of using workampers?
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mpj
Mid-Missouri
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From a campground owner: To answer a few of the problems encountered -
1. ALWAYS get a work agreement. If the employer does not offer one, create one and ask him to sign. They can be as simple as 2 paragraphs: what you are giving the employer - hours, duties, etc, and what the employer is giving you - full hookup (spell it out water, electric (50 or 30 amp), and sewer at the site, CATV and or WIFI, if applicable) and the wage, if any. If the employer does not offer and will not sign what you have created, then possibly that is an indication that things WILL change from what was said in the interview. We, BTW, promise the workamper couple the same days to work, not necessarily the same hours, due to the jobs they will be doing.
2. ASK questions - lots of them. We were once sent a 6 page questionaire BEFORE the actual interview. The prospective worker wanted to know everything from what their specific schedule would be - what shift they would be working, what hours and days of work - to what kind of chemicals we used to clean the restrooms. THAT was a bit much. We answered what we could, but refused to be pinned down before the person was even hired! The important question of "will my cell phone work?" was not one of the questions. (BTW - check the website for your cell phone provider. Most have maps of their coverage areas, and roaming areas. You can create your own lists.
DO NOT ASSUME ANYTHING. Different employers work differently. If a question pops into your head, no matter how trivial, ASK! If it is that important to you, the employers should be willing to answer. Also, you can ask the same questions in a variety of ways so that it appears to be a different question. If you get conflicting answers, you may want to re think the position.
3. Texan wrote: "Exactly what I was talking about, changing work expectations after arrival and telling half truths to get you there. This is much more common than some think and if campgrounds want to keep their good workers, they need to police their own ranks. Our experience this summer soured us on any commercial campground."
There you go lumping employers into one basket. Please do not let this one experience change your thoughts on workamping at a commerical/private park. Learn something from it; do your homework in the future - find out as much as you can about the campground - read reviews on the park, call and talk to the manager, visit the park if possible, etc. Sometimes just talking to them will give you the "gut feeling" about how you will be treated. I cannot impress on everyone how important it is to get a work agreement. Even the larger properties have a work agreement. There are plenty of good employers out there who run a commercial campground. We are all just people, but we are not all perfect. We just do the best we can. Let your gut feelings guide you. If something does not feel quite right, there may be a reason for it.
Just my POV and Thanks for Listening!
* This post was
edited 10/05/08 06:59pm by mpj *
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